If you like your music with a little guitar, there is a very good chance you are familiar with the legendary broadcaster, Matt Pinfield. Over his storied career, Pinfield has worked on many projects, none more pronounced than his show New & Approved which airs Sunday nights at 95.5 FM, KLOS in Los Angeles.
Recently, he caught up with his old friend Mike Ness. As you may know, Ness is the lead singer of the legendary Orange County-based punk band, Social Distortion. He has been at the helm for the last four decades. His music is the stuff that made him an icon among icons. Songs like “Bad Luck,” “Ball and Chain,” “Ring of Fire,” “Mommy’s Little Monster,” and “Story of My Life,” the list of era-and life-defining songs goes on and on.
Not long ago, it was announced that Ness was diagnosed with tonsil cancer.
This diagnosis caused a myriad of events that cascaded upon not just Ness, but his family, friends, and all his fans worldwide. As expected, Ness underwent surgery and subsequently completed radiation and six weeks of a mild chemo infusion.
It’s been a minute since Ness has sat down to speak about life, cancer, and Social Distortion. Here is some insight to the story of his life, so far!
THE INTERVIEW
Hey, it’s Matt Pinfield. It’s KLOS “New and Approved.” I’m here with an old friend of mine who I’m so excited to have on the show… and that’s Mike Ness from Social Distortion. Mike, it’s so great to see you.
NESS – Good to see you, man.
PINFIELD - You know, we go back a long way now, and it’s long.
NESS – You know, I was trying to remember how long. I want to say we were maybe still in college? Yeah, it was really college radio.
PINFIELD – Yeah, it was in college radio.
NESS - Prison bound.
PINFIELD – Yeah, when I was back in Jersey.
NESS – You know what I mean?
PINFIELD – And you guys played City Gardens or places like big. Yeah. You remember those shows? Of course, yeah, it was incredible. So that’s when we finally connected back then and became friends and then through all those other years at various stages.
NESS – Of our careers, which is great.
PINFIELD – So I’m glad we’ve had that friendship all these years. And first of all, I just want to say it’s great to see you here. All of us were extremely concerned, all your friends, all your fans, when you were diagnosed with tonsil cancer, and you’ve been through some incredible group of treatments, and I can only imagine how brutal that is. So, talk to me about it.
NESS - First of all, obviously, it wasn’t in the plan, so the shock is a lot just to take in. But, yeah, the surgery, you can hear it in my voice. It’s still weak just talking. I have a lot of work to do before April for a tour of rehab, but it’s only been a month since the treatments ended. But, yeah, it’s been hell because head and neck is a little bit different than other types of cancers, and they have to go in and disrupt major structures that you’ve been living with your whole life. I had to learn how to swallow all over again, and speech is just slowly getting stronger and then eventually singing.
I thank the Lord for the love that I have found And hold you tight ’cause tomorrow may never come
Social Distortion
PINFIELD – Yeah. Well, I’m so glad, though, that you’ve come out the other side, and you’re a fighter, man. You’ve always been. That’s who you are.
NESS – Yeah, I mean, I should have been dead a long time ago.
PINFIELD – I say that myself pretty regularly, and I’m super grateful that we’re here, but that’s great. And so when it came to the new album, you were already starting, like, pre-production when you got diagnosed, right?
NESS - We were halfway done.
PINFIELD – Wow.
NESS – Yeah. We were literally in the studio laying down bass tracks when I got the call, and I just had to shut it down. I got the call, and I got in my car and left. I wanted them to finish the day.
PINFIELD – That’s emotional, so much emotional things to take that in and to have to process that at that period. But the good news is it’s great on the upside that you’re going to go out with your old friends.
NESS – Bad Religion. Yeah, well, we tried it in Australia, and it was like, tremendously successful and we’ve only done co-headlining once before. That was with Flogging Molly, which was also a lot of fun, two good camps coming together, playing shreds, playing in front of more people every night and getting new fans along the way. So, it’s a great experience and, yeah, we’re looking forward to it.
PINFIELD – I think it’s going to be great. How many dates are there?
NESS – About 40.
PINFIELD – Or do you know how many?
NESS – Something like that.
PINFIELD – Yeah, nine weeks, which will be great. We’re looking forward to it. And there’s also, of course, the new album which you started on.
NESS – January, February, we’ll finish the guitar parts and keyboards and all the music stuff. I wanted to wait at least to get one tour behind me to get the voice strong in to do the vocals.
PINFIELD – Yeah.
NESS – So, we’ll probably cut the vocals in June or July.
PINFIELD – Yeah. So maybe before 2024, end of year release or beginning of 2025.
NESS - Yeah.
PINFIELD – You always write from the heart. You write from personal experience. Tell me, is going through this recently, has that made you write new lyrics or rethink some of the songs that were on this record?
NESS – Well, it’s definitely made some of the ones I’ve already written. I write about hard times sometimes. Certain songs now have completely new meaning to me, but the material on this album, a lot of it is very reflective prior to this, kind of going back to sometimes as far back as when I was starting the band and what it was like when 99% of society was telling you, you can’t do this. I don’t know about you, but my personality is, if you tell me I can’t do something, not only am I going to do it, but I’m going to be successful at it.
Life goes by so fast You only want to do what you think is right Close your eyes and then it’s past, story of my life
Social Distortion
PINFIELD – Yeah. And try and kick ass, when I look back to… you were born in Lynn, Massachusetts, right? But then moved to Southern California and you loved rock and roll like I did, and just listened as a sponge to everything, whether it’s Beatles, Stones, Creedence. I mean… a list of people that you listen to and of course, discovering and falling in love with punk rock, just like I did; because it was something that was being done by people that were close to our age or our age. It was new and fresh and expressed the feelings that we were having at that time. So back when you look back to ’78. And then, of course, when you ended up releasing the first single on Poshboy. Right. Do you remember the feeling of going in the studio that first time to make that single?
NESS – Of course. He kept telling me to quit trying to sing. Like Joe Strummer, for one. And then I had, like, a bunch of change in my pocket. And I’m bouncing around singing, and it’s like the mic’s picking it up. I was green I was green but, yeah, those early days, it’s fun to go back and reflect on that. And a lot of the spirit of this record is kind of touching on that.
PINFIELD – Yeah, I’m excited to hear that and can’t wait to hear these new songs. The 40th anniversary of “Mommy’s Little Monster.” A record that has just become a blueprint for so many other bands. And music lovers and punk lovers. That record, I remember the first time I saw it in the store and picked it up. I still have a vision of remembering that and falling in love with that record. It’s amazing because it clocks in about 27 minutes. It’s like nine songs. And tell me about that. Because as we go back, and we look at the 40 years. You guys ended up doing that in one session. Right, because you were just trying to save money. Tell me about that.
NESS – Yeah, well, I mean, it was, from what I remember. Because I remember we had all our friends there. It was like a party, so I was wasted the whole time. But it was interesting remastering it. Because it was like I wasn’t paying attention to those kinds of details back then. So, when I was remastering it… it needed a little bit of mid-range added. To get those guitars to ring out a little bit more. But it’s really interesting. I don’t listen to my own music very often. Hardly ever. But when I do now. I’m able to not be so critical. Just on a songwriter’s perspective. I was like, how did I come up with that arrangement or that groove or that riff? It’s not something that would come naturally to me now. It was just such an interesting period. It was the beginning of trying to create something.
PINFIELD – And it’s amazing because you see “The Creeps,” and “Telling Them,” “Another State of Mind.” All these songs that have been covered by other artists that have inspired them. They’ve talked about how much the record meant to them. Was it great to actually, through those years, to see all those bands that would do versions of the songs? Whether it’s Green Day or Face to Face or what was it like?
NESS - Yeah, of course. obviously, it was very flattering.
PINFIELD – So speaking of that, “Another State of Mind,” I think you hit it on the head. Because I don’t watch stuff that I’ve done really, because except for once in a blue moon, just to make sure, just monitor if it’s something recent, that it’s all good, but generally I’m the same way. But have you ever gone back and watched Another State of Mind with your Youth Brigade tour in the past, say, I don’t know, 20 years or so?
NESS – I’m sure I have once. Yeah, it’s a tragic comedy. It’s great.
PINFIELD – I kind of agree with all the other bands that I’ve interviewed over years where they say they learned so much from watching what you guys went through. It was like trial and error.
NESS – Well, it was the epitome of doing it yourself, that’s for sure. I mean, 1982, there wasn’t any major labels knocking on Social Distortion’s door wanting to sign us or promote us or anything. So back then, if you wanted to put a record out. You did it yourself.
PINFIELD – Yeah. And set up the tours yourself and found out other people with fanzines and people that were into like minded music. So you’d get that promoter’s name or that club and then just hope that your Ram McNally map or whatever else it was would get you to the club.
NESS – You were like The French Resistance. Yeah, exactly.
PINFIELD – It’s amazing, but it’s such great stuff, Mike, it was great when the self-titled first album came out on epic, when you guys did the deal and put out those three amazing records in a row as well with epic. And the world embraced the band at that period of time. I mean, it was a perfect time with alternative radio, but those songs have become really classics in people’s lives. Things like “Story of My Life.” I mean, “Ball and Chain,” you’ll hear those songs all the time. And “Ring of Fire,” your version is truly one of my favorites, other than the original, it’s my favorite – and it’s done by Eric Burden and the Animals, some other people. But I’m like, it’s Social Diversion for me. You know what I mean? So, I know that you were going to actually record with Johnny, but he was too sick.
NESS – Yeah.
PINFIELD – Johnny Cash. Because you ended up working his music?
NESS - Yeah, I want to say it was. Well, I know I had submitted a song for the Rick Rubin stuff, but I think it was maybe too much like his older stuff, and they wanted to kind of venture away. I sent them a pretty cool rockabilly song I had written, obviously didn’t get the call. And then I wanted to work with June when she was sick. So, I think during my solo records. So, it was unfortunate, but I got to meet Johnny Cash once I still have the guitar he signed. It was when I was recording “White Light.” He was in the studio next door, and I went in. He was eating his dinner, watching that religious guy with the white hair, I said, “Hey, I’m Mike. I’m the guy that did a rock and roll version of ‘Ring of Fire,’ and nice to meet you, and can you sign this?” And then I got out of his hair.
J O H N N Y
C A S H
PINFIELD – That’s amazing. Well, you’ve got so many fans that are like…. Bruce Springsteen, of course, from my home state and had come up and played me to 2008 with Pony and then Asbury Park, my backyard. And then, of course, he was out playing with you in Los Angeles, 2009. Tell me about that relationship.
NESS – Well, I became a fan as I got to know him personally, and then I went and saw his Broadway show, and I was so impressed by that because as you get older, you kind of start to let down your walls. You start to accept things about yourself, and you realize it’s okay to just be yourself. You don’t have to be this character that you’ve created. I thought his show was so vulnerable, and I really gained a lot of respect for him after I went twice.
PINFIELD – Yeah, that’s great.
NESS – I’m glad. the second time I went… I think, I went by myself.
PINFIELD – Yeah. Because it’s that relationship you have with music, you know what I mean?
NESS – Sure.
PINFIELD – And storytelling. That’s beautiful.
NESS – Yeah. And just his reaction to the world. That’s how all of us become musicians. We’re reacting to our surroundings growing up, and I guess we’re kind of like journalists. We just kind of witness stuff and then we kind of give our version of it to the world.
PINFIELD – Yeah. I love those two solo albums. I remember when you first came out with “Cheating at Solitaire” and those two records. I want to ask you always, as we fall in love with music, and we discover things and they become a part of our arsenal and our environment and the things that we enjoy. I love that you gave love to and have covered Hank Williams more than once. Tell me about discovering Hank Williams and what you loved about him as a songwriter.
NESS – Well, he’s up there at the top, for sure. Number, probably number one number. It’s him. Buck Owens and George Jones are my favorites. Not just because of what they do with their voices. It was, I don’t know when the first time I heard him. But it was very similar to the first time. I do remember hearing the Carter family at a very early age. And there was just some sort of desperation in their songwriting. It just sounded like they were just down and out and sad. And I just related to that.
PINFIELD – Yeah, I think that’s the thing that pulls everybody in is because again, you used that word before, vulnerability. And that was one of the things that was so great and is great about all that music. Yeah, I mean, I got to say, I can’t wait for the new record. I’m very excited about it because it’s been a while since Nursery, 2011, right?
NESS – And it has a real wave of punk feel to it. Just swinging swagger and attitude and, you know, little bit of AC/DC feel. Yeah, it’s just been a fun record to write. It was tough to pick. I had almost 50 songs written over the last 11 years.
PINFIELD – Yeah.
NESS – But once I kind of got the feel I wanted, it was easy to narrow it down.
PINFIELD – Yeah, that’s great. I loved, you know, growing up around you and I being almost the same age or close to the same age, we, I’m sure, discovered the same records growing up. And of course, that first wave of punk, AC/DC with Bon Scott originally, you know what I mean?
NESS – And going.
PINFIELD – Because I remember Greg Hetson from Bad Religion and Circle Jerks telling me, he goes, “Yeah, they used to put AC/DC in the punk section because they didn’t know what to do, you know what I mean?” Which I thought was funny. But we love those records. I mean, we were just sponges and fans of rock and roll and the punk thing. What are some of those favorite albums for you, Mike? What are some of those seminal records when you look back at your life, what were the things as you went through certain stages?
NESS – Well, obviously the first time I heard the Pistols album was like. They sounded exactly how I felt inside as a 17-year-old kid who’d grown up in an alcoholic family, a misfit in school. But that first wave was just… still had so much traditional influence with it, even though they were trying to be. I mean, the Pistols album is laced with Chuck Berry. Yes, the Ramones are laced with ’60s girl group, but they’re just loud and hard. And Generation X, what a great first.
PINFIELD – Album that was, too.
NESS – I mean, I look very huge with me because it was. I guess if they were going to be put on a label, it was pop punk. Yeah, but it certainly wasn’t.
PINFIELD – Was not at all right, but it.
NESS – Was super catchy songs. Great guitar work, great vocal melodies. Just great songwriting.
PINFIELD – Tony, James, and Billy, man, they nailed that stuff on those records.
NESS – And The Clash. I mean, I remember seeing them in… I think, 1980 down in San Diego, and there was kind of, back then… there was like a stigma. It was like, if you were a punk, you weren’t supposed to become successful. And I was like, bullshit. I looked at The Clash and they had roadies, they had lights, they had good sound, and they put on a good show, and they were professional. And it’s like, that’s what I want to be like. I want to be like them.
PINFIELD – Yeah. Understandably. And that’s the cool thing.
NESS – It was like.
PINFIELD – Yeah, there was always that kind of that attitude. But those records hold up. They’re great. I saw them in ’79 more than once, and I’ve always loved them. One of my favorite bands of all time, certainly. But you’ve got, like I said, you’ve gotten to work with a lot of your heroes, which is great, too, or they’ve learned to appreciate the band. We mentioned alcoholism in our past, and you and I are both in recovery, which I think is great. And you’ve been very open about it. That’s the only reason we talk about it. But I’m so grateful for that. You know what I mean?
NESS – Oh, man. Well, I don’t think either of us would be right here, right now. Yeah, for sure. No, absolutely. That much we know.
PINFIELD – Yeah.
NESS – My worst fear was just being a small little paragraph in a tiny little fanzine, and I died in a motel room. I didn’t want to go out like that.
PINFIELD – No.
NESS – I think because of my childhood hitting bottom. I didn’t want to spend my adulthood living a painful life as well, so it kind of helped me hit bottom a little sooner. I got sober when I was 23.
PINFIELD – Yeah.
NESS – Which is amazing. And then I don’t know where I got it, but I got a work ethic with the band and became this, like, we’re going to rehearse. We’re going to stay here till it sounds good.
PINFIELD – Yeah. Which you’ve done, and that’s great. And that’s why the live shows have always been so great as well.
NESS – Well, that’s where we take our pride. It’s our live show. Yeah.
PINFIELD – It’s amazing. Again, I’m so happy that you’re on the mend and that you’re working at it, and I feel great about the fact that I know that you’ll put everything in your power into the state of recovery. The fact that you came here makes me so happy.
NESS – It feels good to just be working, even if it’s this. April would have been a year that I just been either feeling shitty or going through treatment or in pain of some sort. So now it’s time to. I’ve been really trying to do this meditation, 30 minutes meditation where I just turn off the head and get into the breathing and just get into a positive imagining the future, but also being grateful for what I have. Even though I’m in the midst of rehab right now, getting everything strong again. I’ve got my five senses. I’m not missing any limbs, and I’ve got my family, I got my friends, and I’ve got a promising career to go back to.
PINFIELD – Absolutely.
NESS - So gratitude is huge part of it.
PINFIELD - Yeah. Gratitude is everything. That’s what I remember every morning when I get up. I’m like, I’m grateful I’m still here.
NESS – It’s great man. If everyone could adapt that, I think there’d be a lot less road rage and a lot less things going on in this world.
PINFIELD - I absolutely agree with that. You know, one of the things that I kind of learned and followed in your footsteps was I always found it really fascinating that you love to collect antiques and you love to cool things and also great old cars and stuff. And I always think of you whenever I’m out, and I’m like, I see something like an old turntable from. I bought this old turntable from 1956 with four legs RCA, or the phonic, that came out literally. It was released the same time Elvis released his first RCA single. And I was Mike, I thought about you immediately.
NESS – You always come to mind, which is turn on. Let those tubes warm up.
PINFIELD – Yeah, they sound great.
NESS – Yeah.
PINFIELD – And just looking at the 45 spinning, too. That’s the thing that…
NESS – Yeah, I still collect a little bit, but by myself now, maybe getting rid of certain stuff that I’ve got too much of, because until you have to move it, you don’t realize how much you have. And it’s like, I don’t want to be a hoarder.
PINFIELD – Yeah. I did the same kind of purge. Five trips back to New Jersey to go through storage units.
NESS – Oh, yeah.
PINFIELD – You know what I mean?
NESS – It’ll do it to you. It’s time to move. You’re just like, what the hell?
PINFIELD - Yeah. I’m like… do I need this? I don’t know. This I love.
NESS – This I care about, but I consider myself a custodian of old things, so it’s not like an Ikea thing where it’s just like. I just throw it in a fucking dumpster. Yeah, I’m not moving. It’s going to break. You try to move it. It’s good stuff and it still works. Or it’s still cool, so it’s not like you can just toss it. So. Yeah, maybe it’s a gift. Gift for someone.
PINFIELD - Yeah, that’s what I did. I gave a lot of stuff away. Some of the stuff I took to a store. But I just literally. I totally agree. I think we get to a certain age where like that. So we got to do this. I got to take this time. It’s taking up a lot of space. I’ll simplify things a little bit here, which is great. Right, Mike, listen, I want to just say we are so excited that you came in and love having you here, man.
NESS – Yeah. Well, this is the only interview I’ve done about the reissue of “Mommy’s Little Monster.” And you were my first pick. My only pick.
PINFIELD – Yeah.
NESS – And we go so far back and we’re both still doing it. I want to keep that relationship going.
PINFIELD – Yeah. I’m very grateful for our friendship and for all.
NESS - And I want one of those shirts.
PINFIELD – I’ll get you one.
NESS – Yeah. What size are you?
PINFIELD – Medium.
NESS – Trying to get down to a medium. Yeah. I mean, I lost a lot of weight from the surgery, and I like being out.
PINFIELD – Yeah, I’m going to get you one, and I’m going to send it to you. All right, Larry, we’re going to do that. I’m going to order it for you tonight. I know. Appreciate it, Mike. I love having. You know, I just want to say, it’s so good to see you out and about. We’re excited about the new album, the new tour with Bad Religion that’s going to be happening. And this great reissue of “Mommy’s Little Monster.” With the sound just where it needs to be.
NESS – No, we did everything. We mastered it. Right. We pressed it on vinyl the right way. I was really just not a fan of that in the early 2000s, when people were mastering vinyl the same way they were doing it on CD. And it came out sounding really tinny.
PINFIELD – Right.
NESS – Cheap. And it’s not the way it’s supposed to be.
PINFIELD – Yeah. It’s kind of.
NESS – We did this, right?
PINFIELD – Yeah. And I love that you did that. Because a perfect example is like “London Calling.” Right? If you get the old copies of that that were on Epic or CBS in the UK, they have that depth. And then you’ll hear a reissue, and it’s like, they took that off the CD. It’s like, where’s the bottom?
NESS – All the warmth and body is missing.
PINFIELD – Yeah. And that’s the thing that made you fall in love with music and feel it in the first know, which is great. So, Mike, thanks again for doing this, man. Much love to you and know. Great to have you here. Mike Ness of Social Distortion. Fortieth anniversary of “Mommy’s Little Monster.” Make sure you go grab that now on vinyl. The new album is coming soon, and tickets are available for the tour that’s coming up next year with Bad Religion. I’m Matt Pinfield. Thanks so much for joining us here on KLOS.
